FORD will abandon its Australian operations in 2016, in a massive blow to the nation's manufacturing industry.

The company will announce at 10.45am (AEST) today that it will close its Broadmeadows and Geelong plants, in Victoria.

Sources said Ford had come to a decision that it was no longer viable for it to produce vehicles in Australia.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/nation/ford-set-to-end-car-making-in-australia/story-e6frg6nf-1226648917020


Looks to be 1200 jobs.

inevitable

Over the past decade, Ford and its rival GM Holden have shared in more than $12 billion in taxpayer-funded industry assistance.

now if the other car makers would follow suit and so we can stop giving them govt money

More like 3500 jobs.

Ford employs 3500 people at Geelong and at Broadmeadows in Melbourne.

They said 1200 on news.. must of jut changed

Number of people affected by the decision is 1200..

Excellent, that's one lot of subsidies the taxpayer has saved, Congratulation Unions Australia, you have just shut down another industry.

Hmm pretty sure the Unions haven't constantly handout out billions of tax payer money to a industry that should have been able to survive on its own two feet.

Hmm pretty sure the Unions haven't constantly handout out billions of tax payer money to a industry that should have been able to survive on its own two feet.

No but the unions have made the industry un-affordable. Why pay people $75k/yr when you can pay a chinaman a bowl of rice or an american $30k/yr.

Can Joe Hockey look anymore like an arrogant SOB during this Ford interiew.. The entire bunch of twats look like that kid when you were you younger and they thought they were the bees knees, until you punched them.

It's Australia's unsustainable labour rates that necessitated the subsidies....

Real issue is of course the high cost of living in Aus.

So 3500 at ford, about 6000 at holden, and 12 billion in free government money over the past decade.

Even if they didn't sell a single car in that 10 years, each employee could have been on a 6 figure salary that entire time.

Katter wants a Tariff on imported Cars equivalent to the AUS$ being 0.90c
with the money raised being used to keep Car manufacturing here and all Government Cars to be Aussie made.

We don't have a viable Car Industry.
We are prolonging a catastrophe where jobs that rely on the Car Industry will disappear too. Successive Governments keep it alive but its a zombie Industry.

Devalue the dollar is another option.
Something many Farmers would appreciate.

So 3500 at ford, about 6000 at holden, and 12 billion in free government money over the past decade.Even if they didn't sell a single car in that 10 years, each employee could have been on a 6 figure salary that entire time.

Yeah yeah yeah but its clearly the unions wanting staff to be paid a decent wage at fault here.

So 3500 at ford, about 6000 at holden, and 12 billion in free government money over the past decade.Even if they didn't sell a single car in that 10 years, each employee could have been on a 6 figure salary that entire time.

What about the CEO's yachts?

Yeah yeah yeah but its clearly the unions wanting staff to be paid a decent wage at fault here.

What's a decent wage?

What about the CEO's yachts?

How is the CEO supposed to run a car company without a yacht?

A Yacht with a Golden Toilet I do hope.

$12b. f*** me. What a waste. All that could have gone into developing some industry we could have been competitive in.

$12b. f*** me. What a waste. All that could have gone into developing some industry we could have been competitive in.

Could go back into university's since they got cut. But I would much much rather they took all public cash out of religious schools and used that for the university's.

hardware's funeral will be held next tuesday

Australia makes cars?!

$12b. f*** me. What a waste. All that could have gone into developing some industry we could have been competitive in.

Er that isnt all to ford, or even ford and Holden, three companies make cars in this country

Holden by far is, and has been taking more in handouts (with arguably less to show for investment) than any of them since 97, even in the mega profit years (profits which the parent company gets a large stake in) the figures work out to be about 2k per Commodore is government funding, and with over 50% overseas product in most models is isnt even able to get the Aussie made stamp

Curretly the most Aussie made car is either a Camry or mid spec falcon

i look forward to the liberals being in power and we can have children working in our factories on children salaries.

its a shame to see ford go, gonna be a lot of jobs in the ford factories and all the feeder industries.

writing will be on the wall for holden then, unless their exports can save them.

Terrible news for the boating industry.

It is true, our labour costs are very high compared to most countries.

The only way Australians will accept a reduction in labour costs is by doing indirectly by inflation.

By lowering the value of the aussie $ and keeping wages growth at a minimum the net result will be a reduction in labour costs as a nation. Nobody takes a pay cut directly so they cant whinge about it.

Taggs is this basically correct?

$12b. f*** me. What a waste. All that could have gone into developing some industry we could have been competitive in.

Last time they were talking about another round of hand outs they said the car industry was worth around $1.2B to the SA economy alone. That's annually, so while the $12B over 10 years does sound bad, it mostly goes back into the community.

i look forward to the liberals being in power and we can have children working in our factories on children salaries.

its a shame to see ford go, gonna be a lot of jobs in the ford factories and all the feeder industries.

writing will be on the wall for holden then, unless their exports can save them.

It's Australia's unsustainable labour rates that necessitated the subsidies....

It's Australia's stupidly high taxes and cost of living that necessitated the unsustainable labour rates just so we can buy f***ing groceries and pay the power bills.

I bet this is all somehow Labor and the unions fault. Can cars run on treadmills?

No but the unions have made the industry un-affordable. Why pay people $75k/yr when you can pay a chinaman a bowl of rice or an american $30k/yr.

If that's the case, why does Germany still have a car industry? Oh wait, it's because they make cars most people want to drive.

This is a disgrace


Every single car manufacturing nation in the world is ensured success by two methods:
Financial support
Import Tariffs

Lets look at Australia - $18 per person annually in subsidies and a 5% import tariff.

Germany - $95 per person annually and a 25% import tariff.

If Australia had the same tariffs as Germany, the tariff would pay for all of the subsidies for the next half a decade.
But I would reckon that if we had the tariffs in place, we wouldn't need as high subsidies (which by world standards are very low) and the car industry would run itself.

Every single country that we import cars from at a 5% tariff DO NOT ALLOW US TO EXPORT CARS TO THEIR COUNTRY FOR THE SAME TARIFF.

This is where the government has had it wrong for the whole of the 21st Century.

If Australia had the same tariffs as Germany, the tariff would pay for all of the subsidies for the next half a decade.

so we foster a local car industry by making foreign cars more expensive thereby allowing local cars to become more expensive. right....

should we have a tarrif on TVs and everything else manufactured we import and enjoy on the cheap? if no, why are cars so special?

it's not going to matter that a great wall is $22k or $26k when a significant portion of the population in manufacturing and derivative positions don't have employment

also I don't know what makes manufacturing cars so special, but seeing as every country with car manufacturing supplies subsidies to the companies, there's obviously something that makes them not analogous to televisions.

I think about time. Invest 12 Bill $$ in something we are good at / can advance in.

Agriculture would be good.

Because no one wants a holden or any australian made ford overseas. Small diesel cars are f***ing EVERYWHERE in europe. Why Australians never caught onto this is bizzare.

The reason why Australia never 'caught on' to diseasels is because in europe generally the fuel cost and rego cost were cheaper for diseasels.
Diseasels were only able to have a good power & economy because of turbos, and now that they're making non-performance petrol turbos and hybrids there's no need to have a stinky diseasel.

hehe, diseasel.

hardware

< / 3

So have they killed of holden yet??

Holden will be next
It's not just the tariff situation that's had people turn away from Holden and Ford (however that is the main factor)

It's also the type of cars they're making.

Four door, five or six seat sedans have been the basis, the lifeblood of australian motoring for most of the time the car has existed.

But tastes in cars are changing. As society progresses and the family vehicle becomes more about what mum wants than what dad wants, we're seeing a switch from the Big Aussie Sedans to soccer mum cars. And let me tell you now, there's no-one who is going to be restoring a CR-V Sport 35 years in the future.

But this is not something new. Somehow the idiot SUV bug hasn't been caught in Germany, and they keep on pumping out some of the world's best sedans, and RWD too.

Much like Australia, the big sedan was a staple in the US too. They had two big cars, the
Chevrolet Caprice
http://media.ed.edmunds-media.com/chevrolet/caprice/1996/oem/1996_chevrolet_caprice_sedan_base_fq_oem_1_500.jpg
and the Ford Crown Victoria
http://images.thecarconnection.com/med/2002_ford_crown_victoria_100004802_m.jpg

The Caprice was killed off in 1996 and the Crown Vic stopped being sold to private customers in 2008 and stopped being made in 2011.
Despite the killing off of the caprice, many US law enforcement agencies rued its demise and cottage industries sprung up refurbishing late model caprices for police use.

The US market has already proven that if one can't survive, then neither can the other.

The Commodore is on it's last hurrah. We'll soon have no alternative, no option to own an inexpensive RWD car with a bit of Aussie, a bit of mongrel and fight in it. We'll be subjected to more and more economy-biased cars, with the fun of driving, the fun of breakaway accelleration eliminated.

You all don't realise it, and perhaps it will never bother you, but this really is a decision that we can never return from. Once we lose local Ford manufacturing, and we lose the Falcon (and therefore Territory) we can never return, the startup cost is too great. Like so many other things in society focussed on economising, things are slipping away.

We're actually going backwards.

He's mad, mad like Francis

We're actually going backwards.

Actually, if this would encourage us to stop subsidising Holden and Toyota too, this will be quite a leap forward.

There's nothing special about the car industry, with the possible exception of the amount of public money it manages to consume in order to not sell very much.

And maybe once they're gone, we can get rid of the remaining tariffs. Cheaper, better cars for all!

hardware, what car do you drive?

But tastes in cars are changing.

See: Tesla motors.

Cars are one of those things on the verge of a transition phase; ripe for new competition taking advantage of the changes in the world since they were introduced. Oil prices have massively increased in price, cities are ballooning in size and infrastructure is not dealing with it very well, all sorts of problems.

Germany - $95 per person annually and a 25% import tariff.

I did find this interesting; do you have a source for this info?

It's important to note that (in addition to being awesome and efficient at everything), Germany is like 4x bigger than Australia, and they're competing in a much more active market - they're surrounded by car making nations on all sides that can literally just drive a car into their country.

For us basically every car except those tiny few manufactured locally has to be imported. Government subsidies mean they can sort of rest on their laurels a bit and rely on that advantage to not have to innovate or compete, which means Australians get stuck with whatever is available and have little opportunity to take advantage of international markets where there is better stuff getting made for cheaper (sort of like how video game companies have that protectionist racket going on and we are screwed).

The Germany data is interesting though and it makes me wonder how I'd feel about the whole thing if BMW was an Australian brand and we were talking about shutting that down.

Ultimately I don't like the idea of tariffs or industry support to that level because it risks making the industries completely dependent on them and drives down competition - but if the overall economic result of that activity improves the quality of life for Australians then I guess it is hard to argue against (aside from deadlyf's comment above I'm not sure how the economic benefit of these programmes has been measured?).

---------------

Also please resist the temptation to make racist slurs against people who make cars who happen to live in Asia; it is embarrassing.

f*** the car industry, Holden is now begging for more government cash to save 400 jobs, meanwhile when the Australian games industry imploded there wasn't s*** in the mainstream media when probably 1000 jobs were lost.

If that money had instead gone to renewable resource research or manufacturing we might actually be competitive in the world with our products instead of digging s*** out of the ground and sending it overseas.

It is true, our labour costs are very high compared to most countries.

The only way Australians will accept a reduction in labour costs is by doing indirectly by inflation.

By lowering the value of the aussie $ and keeping wages growth at a minimum the net result will be a reduction in labour costs as a nation. Nobody takes a pay cut directly so they cant whinge about it.

Taggs is this basically correct?

I probably wouldn't agree that it is impossible for nominal wages to fall and that the only way real wages fall is through decreases in real purchasing power caused by inflation.

But most mainstream economists regard nominal wages as "sticky", meaning they don't necessarily quickly or fully adjust downwards to their market clearing level. This can be for a number of reasons including the presence of contracts that can't be immediately amended, information asymmetry, presence of unions, government regulations (e.g. minimum wage, awards, etc), low levels of labor mobility and plain old human stubbornness.

http://cdn.memegenerator.net/instances/400x/15479942.jpg

It really doesn't matter, because in 50 years none of us will be piloting our cars any more.

The only way Australians will accept a reduction in labour costs is by doing indirectly by inflation.

Heh, not by the whinging I hear in our office about no pay rises means a pay cut in real terms. Funnily enough those whinges usually come from unemployable tards that don't have the option of going elsewhere to find their market value.

I know, anecdotal evidence, etc etc...

Heh, not by the whinging I hear in our office about no pay rises means a pay cut in real terms. Funnily enough those whinges usually come from unemployable tards that don't have the option of going elsewhere to find their market value.

They are right. You should tell them that the reason they didn't get a pay rise (even by inflation) is because they aren't meeting their KPIs and if they don't like it, please leave. The door is over there --> We will accept your resignation immediately today and give you your termination payment immediately.

Crisis averted.

They are right, but it's certainly no crisis. If they could leave then they probably would.
I'm just amused at the whinging and lack of self reflection.

hardware, what car do you drive?

I have three cars at the moment. The one I do the most kays in is my old AU Ford Falcon.

I did find this interesting; do you have a source for this info?

Financial Review - Germany $95pp/a, Aust $18pp/a

I don't propose a 1980s scenario where import tariffs were 57% and car makers really did rest on their laurels and the unions did get their ways, but I don't think this 5% situation is right either. There's got to be a reason every other country in the world has protectionist tariffs on vehicles from countries other than their own. It's a source of revenue for the government, and it more than offsets the paltry $18pp that the govt currently spends on our car industry, which employs thousands directly and tens of thousands indirectly.

I think something like 18% would be about right. That way a new Mazda 3 would be $24k not $21k, and the Commodores and Falcons would come down in price because they would sell more cars which would enable them to spread their R&D costs out over more vehicles.

It ain't just the people putting the cars together. It's the people designing them. It's the people who build the plants that the cars get made in. It's the truck drivers who ship the parts to the plant. It's the paint suppliers, it's the seatbelt suppliers. And it's not just them, it's the admin staff that they employ. It's the people who make a days pay off the people who make a days pay off the people who support the people who make the cars.

Look all over the world, the stats are the same - each manufacturing job creates two to three other jobs. It's just so vital that these manufacturing operations continue in Australia.

But no, you're all gonna sit back and say 'Fords are s***' and then go and buy a Great Wall cos it's cheap.

But you love Australia.

Yeah bloody right.

But no, you're all gonna sit back and say 'Fords are s***' and then go and buy a Great Wall cos it's cheap.

Actually, they're more likely to buy a Ford Focus.

There's got to be a reason every other country in the world has protectionist tariffs on vehicles from countries other than their own.

Economically, there isn't. Politically, there must be. I'd hazard a guess that it's because the industry has always been heavily supported by the government, and politicians don't have the backbone to make decisions that will cause concentrated, highly visible job losses, even if it is for the greater good. It's much easier to give the manufacturers some money and get a few good photo opportunities in the lead up to an election.

Ford had their chance to make good with the ford Territory but failed to do so. It's development was cashed up by the Australian Government on the premise that Ford would develop a diesel version and a left had drive version. Ford Australia did NEITHER.
Poor management is the cause of their downfall, the rest of this s*** is excuses.

I for one am sick of paying so much more for everything in this country, cars included. I'm sick of getting f***ing ripped off.
When I was in Russia last month, I was so surprised at how many of the awesome looking Infinity FX35's where on the road.
Then I looked up their price. HALF what we would have to pay here. I will never be able to afford such a car, not here anyway.

The Government charges us stupid amounts for having an decent, safe car for ourselves and out families.

Then-treasurer Peter Costello's LCT placed a 25 per cent levy on vehicles costing more than $55,134, a tax that was increased controversially to 33 per cent by the Rudd government in 2008.

I know these are'nt great examples as they are not the the really the every day cars that my point is about. It will help illustrate the issue to some degree though.
The images are sourced from this article from drive.com.au

http://images-2.drive.com.au/2011/04/15/2308441/1_porsche-911_729-420x0.jpghttp://images-2.drive.com.au/2011/04/15/2308451/range-rover_729-420x0.jpghttp://images-2.drive.com.au/2011/04/15/2308467/lexus_729-420x0.jpg

And to top it off

When Holden exported its Commodore SS to the US as the Pontiac G8 GT, it cost about $30,000, roughly $15,000 less than it costs here

So, the same car we buy here, with the cost of shipping it to the other side of the world, the creating of a left hand drive version and everything, can be sold at A PROFIT for $15,000 less than we pay here.

f*** this s***. Get rid of the lot of them and give me decent cars a real world price.

But no, you're all gonna sit back and say 'Fords are s***' and then go and buy a Great Wall cos it's cheap.

Well, I don't think that's why people buy cars. I'm continually blown away by how many cars that are above the luxury car tax threshold out there.

I am not a car person; I've always thought they were expensive wastes of time. I think a large reason I think that though is because I grew up in a nation where cars are MASSIVELY more expensive than they are elsewhere in the world. I was stunned when I found out (only relatively recently) how much cheaper they are overseas (quel surprise).

Premium import cars are ludicrously expensive, but it doesn't stop people buying them. Someone who drops $80k or whatever on a BMW isn't looking at the price; they're looking at the car they want. They're simply not going to buy a Ford, ever, and whacking a massive protectionist cost on top of that is just sucking money out that might otherwise be going to some other industry that might actually be able to sustain itself on a world scale.

Looking at E.T.s post, is there a breakdown of why they're so much more expensive here? Obviously the Luxury Car Tax is a big chunk of it but I'd love to see a side-by-side comparison of where the money guys (e.g., cost of converting to RHD, import taxes, etc etc)...?

edit: frankly I am sort of offended that you would imply I don't like Australia because I don't own an Australian car (I have a Honda). I bought my car because it was what I wanted at the price I wanted and I thought it would last forever. I'm sure Australian cars are great but there is zero range, and way too much competition. Holden and Ford will never compete in the premium range; cars being a luxury item of course they're never going to be competitive in that space.

Looking at E.T.s post, is there a breakdown of why they're so much more expensive here? Obviously the Luxury Car Tax is a big chunk of it but I'd love to see a side-by-side comparison of where the money guys (e.g., cost of converting to RHD, import taxes, etc etc)...?

5% duty
10% GST
33% LCT (if above $55,134)

And there you have a doubling of the unit price of the goods.

GG Australia.

5% duty10% GST33% LCTAnd there you have a doubling of the unit price of the goods. GG Australia.

LCT is only on cars above like, $57k though, right? So cars under that they are only 15% more.

So if I look at something like a Honda CR-Z the base .au website price is $41,166, and the base US price is $19975USD, although that excludes sales tax (and I can't see what that is from a quick look, anyone know?).

That is a staggering difference that the LCT doesn't impact. What else is there? Obv conversion to RHD is a big deal and shipping to .au is part of it.

Trog, I think you put the rest down to what the car companies "think" the market will endure. As you know, we Aussie's are world famous for being a soft touch and we just pay whatever is asked. That goes for any product line.

Sure, if you spoke to the car company, they would justify modification costs, shipping ect. But that is all utter bull s***. Look at the example of the Holden commodore in my earlier post. It gets shipped to the US, is converted to a left hand drive, is made to comply with local emission laws and can still be sold at a profit for $15K less than we pay for the original version of the thing here.

Trog, I think you put the rest down to what the car companies "think" the market will endure.

well, that is why I'm hoping to see the data ; without it it's basically just conjecture. There are certainly other costs, and knowing what they are will help us figure out what the gap is.

With video games it is really easy - we know it costs (basically) the same for a games company to send a game to me in .au as it does to someone in the US, so any additionally costs on top of that are just market endurance ones. As the price goes up though to car realms, there's a lot more room to hide things in the gaps.

Okay a few things here.

ET Ford did develop a Diesel Territory and it's been on sale for a couple of years now.

And they did export some Territorys overseas but found that the other countries import tariffs were high enough to make them prohibitive to buy for the public.

All the cars that have been mentioned above (Porsche 911, Honda CR-Z) represent fractions of a percent of the total market. If we talk about the Mazda 3 Hatchback, one of the highest selling cars in Australia, in the US it is $20000 and in Australia it is $20490

Obviously in the USA where wages are lower than Australia and company tax is lower and they have a bigger market to sell to (economies of scale). I would have expected a greater gap.

Trog, sorry for any offence caused, it was not targeted at a person but at what i see is a set of conflicting views/actions of members of the wider Australian public - I believe national pride is greater lately than what it has been in the past, but pride for Australian products is at a low and to me it seems like no-one wants to put their money where their mouth is. Also ftr I too currently own a Honda coupe.

well, that is why I'm hoping to see the data ; without it it's basically just conjecture. There are certainly other costs,

You may be slightly missing the point about the Commode example. It is the same situation in reverse and exposes the systemic price gouging taking place here.

Beyond tax issues, Holden is subject to the same on-costs as any company exporting vehicles. Ie, developments costs, shipping costs ect. They are still able to deliver a fully modified vehicle to the US market for 15K less than the original car costs here in Aust. They will NOT be selling the car at a loss in the US therefore without a shadow of a doubt, the difference in Australia is obviously profit taking to the limits the local market stupidly endures.

Hardware. Quoting from the Australian

Former Victorian premier John Brumby defended government assistance to Ford and said a number of poor decisions by the car maker's United States headquarters had led to its decline.

“Ford has received significant support from government over the years including our government in Victoria between 2000 and 2010,” Mr Brumby said.

He said the production of the Ford Territory in 2004 made Ford's Australian operations a “world leader”.

“At state level and federal level we assisted the Ford Motor Company with the development of that vehicle because it was really a breakthrough vehicle,” he said.

“But the basis of that was that they would produce a diesel and a left-hand drive for export.

“Ford did neither and we were very disappointed about that ... (and it) cost Ford in the longer term.”

Read it again

Read it again

I did, what am I missing? Give me a hint man! :)

He's been slightly misquoted / out of order

He's talking about the time his state govt contributed to Ford, 2000-2010, and how Ford did not release the Diesel version of the territory in that period of time (it came in 2011).

He's ignoring the fact that the development work actually did get done in 2007/2008/2009/2010 when his state govt did contribute.

Just remember when the Territory was released in 2004, no-one drove diesels because petrol was 72c/ltr

So, Ford took 7 further years post release of the model to release a Diesel version and they missed the opportunity to jump into International markets. He made that point also. If Ford had of developed the Diesel and a left hand drive version early enough, the markets overseas where ready for that kind of product that would later be filled by dozens of other companies.

Lets agree. Ford made commercial decisions that led to this point. They missed the boat on International exports and that was a big part of Brumby's point.

Yes they did. Ford Australia was under the control of the awesome late Geoff Polites in the early 2000s, who moved on in 2004, and was replaced by a bunch of schmuck Americans who didn't know their hat from their a******. Through hindsight, we can see they made a series of errors. But you've got to remember that in 2004 Ford was selling 85,000 Falcons (10% of the market) and to them, the future didn't look that bleak, they didn't need to export Aussie made Fords.

Just remember when the Territory was released in 2004, no-one drove diesels because petrol was 72c/ltr

2004 was the year prices broke $1/L, and they were over $0.80/L for most of 2003.

All the cars that have been mentioned above (Porsche 911, Honda CR-Z) represent fractions of a percent of the total market. If we talk about the Mazda 3 Hatchback, one of the highest selling cars in Australia, in the US it is $20000 and in Australia it is $20490

Isn't the case for all cars (this list is from 2011 as I can't be assed getting upto date figures) some of the differences are pretty high even factoring in taxes.

Honda Jazz 1.5
($A19,190) — $US15,100 (-21%)
Mini Cooper S
($A42,850) — $US22,300 (-48%)
Toyota Corolla Conquest
($A24,490) — $US16,520 (-33%)
Mazda3 Maxx Sport
($A26,320) — $US20,045 (-24%)
Toyota Prius
($A39,900) — $US21,650 (-46%)
Volkswagen Golf 103TDI
($A34,490) — $US23,885 (-31%)
Toyota Camry Sportivo
($A33,990) — $US23,590 (-31%)
Mazda6 Classic
($A31,750) — $US22,635 (-29%)
Subaru Liberty Premium wagon
($A40,990) — $US25,295 (-38%)
Honda Accord V6
($A49,990) — $US27,355 (-45%)
Mazda CX-9 Luxury
($A57,015) — $US32,445 (-43%)
Toyota Kluger KX-S
($A55,490) — $US34,750 (-37%)
Volvo XC60 T6
($A65,950) — $US38,400 (-42%)
BMW X5 35i
($A103,900) — $US46,300 (-55%)

At least ford didnt try and hold the government to ransom like Holden

Also, what a thought invoker, why has GM let another GM brand compete in the same market? Holden might not be as golden

LCT is only on cars above like, $57k though, right? So cars under that they are only 15% more. So if I look at something like a Honda CR-Z the base .au website price is $41,166, and the base US price is $19975USD, although that excludes sales tax (and I can't see what that is from a quick look, anyone know?). That is a staggering difference that the LCT doesn't impact. What else is there? Obv conversion to RHD is a big deal and shipping to .au is part of it.

US sales tax chart http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sales_taxes_in_the_United_States#By_jurisdiction

As you can see some states have no sales tax while others have different scales depending ont he good being sold.

But even if you go to the higher side of things with a 12% sales tax the cars would still only cost $22,500USD. Still around $19,000 less than the Aussie price.

Hardware, Did you buy your AU Falcon new or second hand?

I see where you're going with this.
Second hand, through a company I worked for who bought it new.

That is a staggering difference that the LCT doesn't impact. What else is there? Obv conversion to RHD is a big deal and shipping to .au is part of it.

you're thinking about it all wrong. Sure there's differences in tax and there's market efficiencies and stuff, but by far the most significant reason that cars are more expensive in Australia is because people will pay that much for them here...

analysing the why is a bit of a joke, much like the government's recent 'investigation' into IT pricing.

you're thinking about it all wrong. Sure there's differences in tax and there's market efficiencies and stuff, but by far the most significant reason that cars are more expensive in Australia is because people will pay that much for them here...

Yes, I realise this - the first step is to make people aware of the price difference (which is gradually happening) and trying to generate more awareness about it.

I think having more information about the /reasons/ why the prices are so different would help consumers understand what they should be asking for.

Shrugging and saying it's a joke and is too hard to figure out is exactly why they can get away with it for so long. And the lack of transparency makes discussions about things like tarrifs, taxes, etc much more complicated. For me, anyway.

I see where you're going with this.
Second hand, through a company I worked for who bought it new.

It is obvious isn't it.

But no, you're all gonna sit back and say 'Fords are s***' and then go and buy a Great Wall cos it's cheap.

But you love Australia.

Yeah bloody right.

Back to this comment, don't you think that it is a bit rough to say that when the car you drive, even though it is Australian made, was bought second hand and therefore none of the money for that purchase went to the company that made the car?

Sure you might have bought factory parts for it over the years but selling new cars is how the manufactures make the majority of their money.

Maybe if you and every other second hand Holden/ford driver bought a new car then ford would still be around?

Personally I doubt that because their cars aren't what people want any more, ergo people don't buy them. They didn't adapt to that change in people's expectations or desires and I can't see that as being anyone's fault but their own.

I use to like Holden as my dad was always a "Holden guy" but after owning one, I thought never again. The last car I bought, back in 2003, was a new Audi S3. I haven't bought a car since then because my S3 is still in tip top shape after 10years and over 200,000km and now I telecommute my need for a car has been greatly reduced.

Don't get me wrong here, I try hard to buy Australian made and I do so even if it is the more expensive option, but I am not going to buy Australian if the quality isn't as great and I wouldn't expect anyone else to either.

oh well..


our kids (if you have them) won't look back and think about Ford..


it's just another name of just another piece of tech that fell by the wayside

oh well..our kids (if you have them) won't look back and think about Ford..it's just another name of just another piece of tech that fell by the wayside

Umm, no. Ford will still be very prevalent in Australia. They will all just be imported cars.

http://images.smh.com.au/2013/05/09/4258954/mule_729-620x349.jpg

Umm, no. Ford will still be very prevalent in Australia. They will all just be imported cars.

This!! Some people seem to be confusing that part, the only real name plate going is falcon, which was one of the longest running name

The only car company at risk is Holden, and given that exports are unlikely, and not profitable (the gto was cheaper to buy in the US, than the ss was here, and we the Aussie tax payer took that hit) with opel now in the AU market, and GM trying to slowly reduce the amount of company names used over the world (as we become more global, it has hurt their marketing a little as brand loyalty is hard when they go by so many names) I give Holden 15 years max as a company

Caption should read "TOO LITTLE TOO LATE"

http://images.smh.com.au/2013/05/09/4258954/mule_729-620x349.jpg