Demands of Kidnapper& Chinese Release Negotiations

http://josh.net.au/china1.png
'I have 3 demands or I'll kill the boy!'

http://josh.net.au/china2.png
Negotiators assess the situation from next door.

http://josh.net.au/china3.png
Head Negotiator dispatched

http://josh.net.au/china4.png
Negotiations begin

http://josh.net.au/china5.png
Negotiations concluded

http://josh.net.au/china6.png
In this country, we would block off the street, take 12 hours to talk him out of it, spend $5 million giving him a fair trial, and pay his food and lodging for life.

No wonder their products are cheaper than ours.

is it a bird? is it a plane? No it's Snopes!

According to that the guy lived, wtf

f*** snopes is awesome. Also, political commentary on this sort of thing - its funny to see that in the Snopes thing it was originally Japan (someone was probably pissed about the whaling) and now its changed back to China (probably not even knowing it really WAS China), presumably as a result of all the Tibet stuff going on.

yeah, I often wonder if it's latent racism, or just sheer laziness that causes a person to just pass on stuff like this without a quick google to confirm it.

Is it not possible for someone to want to innocently share something shocking or interesting without spending time running it through filters?

that's just a cover they use. sharing ignorance is part of their being. it makes them more complete.

sure it is, but not with inherently racist, or at least politically motivated bulls*** like that.

a gif of some dude slapping a chick and cream pie'ing her in the face would be a more suitable for an innocent posting of something shocking or amusing.

besides your brain should do the initial filtering for you. Raise a flag and say

"hey this doesn't seem quite right, check it out before sending it around or you'll make us look bad"

"shut up brain or I'll poke you in the eye with a cue tip"

Why is it racist ? I think it's awesome the no bulls*** approach demonstrated in the series of pics. I have a good friend who is in the AFP and the screwing around involved in situations like this in Australia is nothing but a waste of time and money.

yeah, I often wonder if it's latent racism, or just sheer laziness

I'm definately not a racist, perhaps more of an eracerist...

I just wanna rub out all the stupid people :P

Why is it racist ? I think it's awesome the no bulls*** approach demonstrated in the series of pics. I have a good friend who is in the AFP and the screwing around involved in situations like this in Australia is nothing but a waste of time and money.

But they didn't have a no bulls*** approach, they negotiated for two hours, and when it looked like he was on the verge on harming a hostage they decided to disarm him by shooting him.

....So its racist ???

The bulls*** doesn't end when the guy is disarmed, it goes on when they have to deal with him if he's not dead..

the racism ( or just plain ignorance ) comes from your ability to believe an indepth story from just a few photos based on the fact that it's those funny yellow people.

I think it's more racist to say they're funny yellow people, than to receive an email saying they're chinese, with pictures of people that sure look like chinese and go gee, maybe they're chinese. I don't live my life automatically suspecting that everything is a conspiracy or some cryptic web of lies that I have to run through google before reading.. I think it's ridiculous that you can't take it for what it is (an amusing email) without getting all 'stop the racism' about it.

I guess that's the difference between a democracy and a communist regime.

In a democracy you must be proven guilty by a court first (unless of course Jack Bauer has determined you are guilty).

I think it's more racist to say they're funny yellow people, than to receive an email saying they're chinese, with pictures of people that sure look like chinese and go gee, maybe they're chinese. I don't live my life automatically suspecting that everything is a conspiracy or some cryptic web of lies that I have to run through google before reading.. I think it's ridiculous that you can't take it for what it is (an amusing email) without getting all 'stop the racism' about it.

I used the term 'funny yellow people' to demonstrate the racist undertones of the email.

I think it's ridiculous that you can't see the email for what it is, a selection of carefully captioned images designed to manipulate you via your ignorance and racist ( call it racial profiling, stereotyping, whatever ) into believing something that's not true.

It's not that different to G.W. using 9/11 as an excuse to invade IRAQ, just a different scale.

into believing something that's not true

And what would that be?

I'm confused, snopes is saying it's true but stinky writes like it is a fake.. unless snopes "true" means "not true" and its a double negative to indicate that yes, it's true this is a fake.

I've seen enough Jackie Chan movies to know that asian cops are not to be f***ed with.

And what would that be?

That the negotiations consist of shooting the guy, and therefore chinese products are cheaper than ours.

Er pretty sure that was a joke

I'm confused, snopes is saying it's true but stinky writes like it is a fake.. unless snopes "true" means "not true" and its a double negative to indicate that yes, it's true this is a fake.

The story is real, however the email that the OP pasted to QGL tells a cutdown story that deceives the reader about the negotiaions that took place prior to shooting him.

Er pretty sure that was a joke

No, it's carefully crafted part of the manipulation, add in a small truth to make the whole story seem plausible. One of the most commonly used tools in the propaganda toolbox.

Again, I think it's got a lot to do with how you take the email...

Again, I think it's got a lot to do with how you take the email...

There's two ways to take the email :

1) through ignorance be manipulated into believing exactly what it tells you.

2) See through the attempted manipulation and see the email for what it really is.

Is it racist to the chinese or to us? Didnt he compliment them on their efficient negotiating skills. Did they not divert a crisis by preventing an escalation outside of their own control. And as for the cheap products, you cant argue with that... Especially if your in china... youll get shot!

In a democracy you must be proven guilty by a court first (unless of course Jack Bauer has determined you are guilty).

Like Abu Ghraib ?
Like the rendition program ?
Like camp x-ray ?
Like the 1200 people that got arrest post 9/11 (including some hundred US citizens) because they were muslim ?
You mean like Haneef ?

We live in a democracy, you get tried by the media and by people scoring political points long before you reach a court room.

You sound like you have a degree in arts? Or do you wear high vis. shirts to work every day?

You shouldnt post if your ignorant to the subject

And as for the cheap products, you cant argue with that... Especially if your in china... youll get shot!

You shouldnt post if your ignorant to the subject

lol

haha!

Boy i wish i saw this thread earlier

So in your heightened sense of being, in seeing through the attempted manipulation, what have you got out of this email ?

Beijing olympics 2008! Be there or be shot

So in your heightened sense of being, in seeing through the attempted manipulation, what have you got out of this email ?

all I got out of the email was a roll of the eyes followed by a reasonable argument with an etard.

I think you mean retard.

Well personally I thought it was a good example for hostage negotiators around the world

what have you got out of this email ?

Dont try to take the torch hostage.

See tic, through ignorance, you've been manipulated into believing that those people are chinese

Well personally I thought it was a good example for hostage negotiators around the world

But it's not an example of anything of the sort, because it didn't happen the way the email says it did. They negotiated for 2 hours before making the decision to shoot, and that was only because the guy seemed on the verge of harming somebody.

I'm sure American SWAT or our own equivalent would have made the exact same call.

I'm sure American SWAT or our own equivalent would have made the exact same call.

To be fair, at Waco they took 50 days or so before they torched 75 people including 20+ kids and a couple of pregfnant women...

Like Abu Ghraib ?
Like the rendition program ?
Like camp x-ray ?
Like the 1200 people that got arrest post 9/11 (including some hundred US citizens) because they were muslim ?
You mean like Haneef ?

1. Enemy combatants don't enjoy those rights in any country. It's called international law.
2. People temporarily detained for anti-terror purposes have not been found guilt of anything nor sentenced to any punishment. Haneef was detained for like a week, the kidnapper in question was shot in the head.

Yeah so way to completely miss the point.

Problem is half an hour after shooting him he felt like shooting another one

2. People temporarily detained for anti-terror purposes have not been found guilt of anything nor sentenced to any punishment. Haneef was detained for like a week, the kidnapper in question was shot in the head.

Yeah detained for only a week. And only had his name splashed all over the papers as a terrorist.

Only.

2 Hours is f*** all negotiation time

Yeah well alternatively you could live in China or North Korea or Iran where people have no rights at all.

One dude gets a bad run in the media, or thousands of people get rounded up into prison camps on a routine basis many of whom are never seen again.

As they say, if you don't like Australia's wonderful freedoms there's the door.

last edited by infi at 15:58:28 17/Apr/08

I'm sure American SWAT or our own equivalent would have made the exact same call.

Didn't Martin Bryant continue shooting people for days and the cops weren't allowed to shoot him? I was only young so don't remember it too well.

Hey guyz, its okay to be detained for no reasonz and dragged over hot coals by teh mediaz because over in NK it is way worse. If you dont like it go there!

f***ing retard.

Didn't Martin Bryant continue shooting people for days and the cops weren't allowed to shoot him? I was only young so don't remember it too well.

No.

f***ing retard.

yes, he is.

Didn't Martin Bryant continue shooting people for days and the cops weren't allowed to shoot him? I was only young so don't remember it too well.

I assume you mean because he was inside with hostages or something? that's the only way I could think of, but even then I don't think it'd go down like that in general circumstancecs

From what I remember he never had hostages, only corpses.

Beijing olympics 2008! Be there and be shot

fixed

1. Enemy combatants don't enjoy those rights in any country. It's called international law.

Most of the people in Abu Ghraib aren't enemy combatants they get called "illegal combatants" so the US can specifically ignore international law (ie. the Geneva convention), the 1200 people arrested in America after 911, were also non combatants they were all on US soil. 70 of them were US citizens, 30 of them kept for more then 2 months all under a "material witness" clause, again loopholes to avoid the law. 13 got apologies, over half of them were never used as witnesses... 1 of them was kept a year. None were charged with anything.

Honestly infi ... you are either ignorant or are so caught up in believing everything right wing is good that you can't see the dangerous path the western democracies headed down. Governments using legal loopholes to detain people indefinitely, how is that different to them passing laws to make it legal ?

Surely we can follow the laws we champion to others ?

As they say, if you don't like Australia's wonderful freedoms there's the door.

One of the freedoms is to dislike and discuss poor/shabby/illegal treatment by our government and its allies ... if you don't like us doing that ... stiff s***

Yeah well alternatively you could live in China or North Korea or Iran where people have no rights at all.

You sound like you have such strong opinions ... but how many of your possessions have made in China written on them.

And simply because their system has worse abuses does not make ours perfect.

Hey guyz, its okay to be detained for no reasonz and dragged over hot coals by teh mediaz because over in NK it is way worse. If you dont like it go there!

1. yeah like people who are not suspected of terrorism don't get hauled over the coals by the media. some of those people are even politicians! the media doesn't give two s***s about anyone so don't go sympathising for terror suspects because the media is giving them a hard time.

2. As per usual you have no f***ing idea what you are talking about. Section 105.4 of the Commonwealth Crimes Act is quite clear. A person can only be detained on a preventative detention order if a judge is satisfied that sub-sections (4) to (6) are satisfied.

(4) A person meets the requirements of this subsection if the person is satisfied that:
(a) there are reasonable grounds to suspect that the subject:
(i) will engage in a terrorist act; or
(ii) possesses a thing that is connected with the preparation
for, or the engagement of a person in, a terrorist act; or
(iii) has done an act in preparation for, or planning, a terrorist act; and
(b) making the order would substantially assist in preventing a
terrorist act occurring; and
(c) detaining the subject for the period for which the person is to be detained under the order is reasonably necessary for the purpose referred to in paragraph (b).
(5) A terrorist act referred to in subsection (4):
(a) must be one that is imminent; and
(b) must be one that is expected to occur, in any event, at some
time in the next 14 days.
(6) A person meets the requirements of this subsection if the person is
satisfied that:
(a) a terrorist act has occurred within the last 28 days; and
it is necessary to detain the subject to preserve evidence of,
or relating to, the terrorist act; and
(c) detaining the subject for the period for which the person is to
be detained under the order is reasonably necessary for the
purpose referred to in paragraph (b).

The test is quite high and people cannot be detained for "no reasonz".

In short - you fail, again.

last edited by infi at 18:11:23 17/Apr/08

lets get emo about pictures on the internet guys

ok Mr Egan that covers Haneef (OH NOES TEH SIM CARD) but what about the 1200 guys Obes is talking about?

oh god im agreeing with obes.

SHOOT ME NOW

Ok Iraq is a mess. There's no denying it. Everyone is just trying to make the best of a f***ed up situation. I have nothing more to add about that except that it is horrible and you gotta do what you gotta do.

Hopefully no one will be unlawfully detained eventually, because I am just as frightened about its potential abuse as you.

And I would submit that America's population of 270something million people are largely free (well from detainment not the slavery of taxation).

Extraordinary rendition well that has no basis in law and is clearly illegal and unethical.

Haha!

In a bizarre coda to the story, Chinese media reported that the kidnapper was initially declared dead but was later found to be alive when funeral workers heard him groan as they were preparing him for cremation

Also this thread sucks balls

Ok Iraq is a mess. There's no denying it. Everyone is just trying to make the best of a f***ed up situation. I have nothing more to add about that except that it is horrible and you gotta do what you gotta do.

Its this sort of lamearse s*** that gets c***s un-elected, c***?

http://img501.imageshack.us/img501/1133/gigqspltkc9.jpg
sorry, the funny pic thread has gone so i'm just posting this in here

Oh relax stinky, anyone with half a brain knows that racism isn't a manipulation, it's a competition!

http://iputatextonimage.com/wp-content/ching-chong.jpg

Do I win?

That cat then probably shot the owner after 2 hours of negotiation

Look on the bright hand side of China.

They have the world's highest population and all you have to feed them is rice and coal. The fact that all the ships are waiting on the western Australian port just to pick up coal is enough to be said and done.

Okay wtf at thread.
Here's what you should've done.

1. Look at picture
2. slight chuckle
3. ?????
4. profit
5. move the f*** on.


so much angst and arguing that's going to result in absolutely nothing but wasted time arguing over teh internetz.

/drunkpost.
sorry, just read this and thought WTF are all these people carrying on over this?

I got the same email years ago, but it had more piccies showing signage on the building.


the writing was clearly chinese. s***'s like that there I guess.


I suppose it's not too much different to arabs cutting off your hand for stealing or stoning married chicks to death if they f*** someone else other than their husband


why is this really a surprise? move on and stuff seriously