providing phone support to my father who is running rj45 from one room to another and making it a cross over rather than going through a switch. He's having to put the wires on using pliers as he doesn't have a crimpling tool.

Current status is, when plugged in to the two pcs, the main computer says 'connected' the second computer says 'network cable unplugged or minimal network connection' or some such.

Why would one show network cable connection but the other not?

Can't ping between them. Only 25M of cable.

are the network settings/network cards the same on both pc

I'd say because the wiring is pooed.

Why not just buy a crossover? Probably be easier... Alternatively google a how to on making a crossover cable so you get the wiring correct.

I'm not really an expert when it comes to crimping cables, but perhaps using pliers aint gonna cut it.

Also how much non-shielded cable is there at the end where he's been f***ing with it, if theres too much it will just f*** over the signal altogether.

the network cards are setup correct (i believe), i think it's a wiring issue, i was hoping someone would say "if you have connection at one end and not the other then wire 4 on the second connection is wrong" or some such. I'll let him know about the shielding.

I think he's going to have to resort to buying two already made 15M cables and use a crossover link in the middle, but that's much more expensive (retail) than fixing this cable.

last edited by natslovR at 17:14:19 27/May/06

just go wireless... lol

We discussed this, wireless was too complicated. He's going through brick walls and down a floor from end to end of a large, long, 5 bedroom house. He'd have to worry about encryption and clashing with his neighbours and the university dorms.

And you just know those uni-bums would be trying to hack it all the time even if he could find a channel that wasn't being used.

I've a couple of old 10/100 hubs sitting round spare if you want em

Thanks for the offer HERMITech, but that won't be necessary.

Most modern network cards perform auto-crossover, so it doesn't matter whether you use ordinary or crossover cables.

all i see in this thread is blah blah blah im a f***in noob :P

How the f*** is wireless too difficult, it's easier than wiping your ass.
He has f***ed the wiring I bet you. Get a dicks*** crimper then throw it away cause it will last 1 crimp then it's all over red rover, what standard did he do A or B?

parabol: you mean most modern switches, the NIC won't care what you plug into it as long as it terminates correctly.

sigh too drunk to help more night.

if they are dlink cards they dont use normal crossover cables I had this problem ages ago

No way are you going to get the cable to work without a crimper, I tried crimping a cable once with a flathead screwdriver and a hammer, took me a few hours, its f***ing silly business.

If your dad can't afford a 25m cable, or a crimper, he probably shouldnt be spending money on technology

skitza your a f***ing tool, would your parents know how to setup a wireless network?

I know mine wouldn;t have a f***ing clue.

My house is funny when it comes to cat 5.

for some reason it wont run 100mb properly. i've tried both, running new cable and using a different switch.

basically to get it to work i force the network cards to 10 mb. fixed..

i'm guessing there is some kind of interference, either from the house 240v or bermuda triangle.

With proper guidance anything is possible, saving all the hassle i'd do it myself :) <3 u Heardy

you've got to explain everything on here don't you even if it doesn't relate to the problem!!

Dad's mate said he'd do the network in the house for a carton when we decided that'd be the better way to go over wireless, and gave Dad ~50M of cable. After we had fun wiring my house when they visited he decided he'd try to do it himself rather than waiting for his mate to get back from holidays in a few weeks.

In my place we connected the cable to wall mounts which are quite easy to do without a full-on crimping tool once you work out what has to be done. But he's not going to wall mounts as it's all brick and too much work so he's just going through the floor straight from PC-PC. He went out and bought 6 rj45 plugs and has been trying to do it himself. Doing the plugs on RJ45 is significantly more difficult than running rj45 to the back of wall mounts.

yes he's cheap, he's a retired baby boomer, it's in their nature. No that doesn't make them too cheap for technology. Wireless is just too much of a hassle for me to setup and support OVER THE PHONE, especially considering the network would have to be secure. They have no mobile devices so really wireless is a waste since the network is required in two fixed points, not roaming.

We will now just wait 4 or so more weeks for his mate to get back from OS, and to find time to earn that carton.

To be honest, getting a sparky to do it wll be a better idea.

Current status is, when plugged in to the two pcs, the main computer says 'connected' the second computer says 'network cable unplugged or minimal network connection' or some such

set static ip on second machine? or is the main machine/router setup for dhcp?

Both are set to static ip, the remote pc has the main pc as it's gateway, but the network cable status issue came about before the tcpip settings were setup.

Skitza,

my dad's mate's a sparky that worked for him before my dad retired. my dad's an ex-sparky, but it's been a long time.

set static ip on second machine? or is the main machine/router setup for dhcp?

As far as I know, a "cable disconnected" message has nothing to with TCP/IP, DHCP or any higher level protocols. It's either a Level 1 or 2 layer problem depending on if there is a hardware/cabling fault or if the operating system has explicitly disabled/reset the transmitter/receiver.

Why would one show network cable connection but the other not?

What I said above.

Most likely the wiring is screwed, which allows traffic in one direction and not another, causing one side to not receive data and not detect the carrier, which the operating system finds out about and whinges.

Last time I had the "minimal network connection" problem, there was either a wiring fault or a problem with that port on the switch I was using.

As far as I know, a "cable disconnected" message has nothing to with TCP/IP, DHCP or any higher level protocols

join two computers together via a crossover (as with the example here) and see for yourself

still - if he's set his addy correctly it's prolly a dud plug on either end of the cable.. if not a break somewhere in the line

join two computers together via a crossover (as with the example here) and see for yourself

I removed the static ip from one of my machines (with direct cross-over cable) and the connection is still active and no disconnection message.

Trust me, it's a Layer 1/2 thing.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OSI_model#Layer_1:_Physical_Layer


natslovr: pretty much what someone else already said - use a crimping tool (carefully, you can still easily make dodgy cables with a crimping tool) and follow this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethernet_crossover_cable

what standard did he do A or B?

If he made a proper crossover, he would have used both...

I'm not sure why you pasted your link Jim.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carrier_sense_multiple_access_with_collision_detection

Carrier-sensing is actually Level 2 (more specific than "Level 1 or 2" than I said earlier), but still below IP, TCP, etc .. so it still has nothing to do with IP address or DHCP servers.

I pasted it for the people claiming that a link is reliant on something as high as the ip protocol - and I had meant to paste this instead: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OSI_model#Description_of_OSI_layers so the page would start there

:/


to quote the original post:

Current status is, when plugged in to the two pcs, the main computer says 'connected' the second computer says 'network cable unplugged or minimal network connection' or some such.

the error pretty much comes up like looking like this?. The screeny is from a pc that was connected via crossover to another machine prior to it's IP being manually set in Windows.

I noted earlier that you'd only talked over the phone to your father, but I'm figuring someone of your resources has gotten down to the bare facts by now. Was it the cable, or a problem with the software config natslovR?

either way, this anomaly has been interesting. my understanding of this scenario has grown further than experience has previously provided.. for once, wiki has provided some interesting input. ta Jim :)

ok here's the update. Dad went and bought 1x15M straight, 1x15M crossover and a "joiner", to completely replace the cable.

That didn't work.

So i had him pull out the PCI card, boot. Plug the PCI card in to a different slot, and boot. WIndows detected this as a realtek and a new network connection appears in his main computer as connection #5. We disabled connection #1 (no actual number) and assigned #5 the IP address. So we now know that the PCI network card is connection #5, and that's the one he's plugged the network cable in to, and we have disabled the onboard NIC to make it clearer what is going on.

Back to the core problem of not being able to ping between the two boxes, with firewalls disabled.

I recon there's something iffy with the network setup on the main box. WHy does the telstra USB adsl modem take up two network connections: network connections. As you can see from the properties device manager it's got alcatel speedtouch and 'efficient netowkrs'. When either of these are disabled the internet doesn't work.

So, the current setup is,
LCA1 Disabled
LCA2 Enabled DHCP
LCA3 Enabled DHCP
LCA5 Enabled, Fixed IP.

The 2nd computer only has the one card and network connection and is fixed ip, with the gateway as the ip of the other
.ie.

main is
192.168.0.1
255.255.255.0

2nd is
192.168.0.2
255.255.255.0
192.168.0.1

But can't ping either from either. They can both self ping.

Oh man, I have no idea what's going on in this thread, so I'll paste a link that might be related:

http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=892896

What the hell is a "joiner"? I think your dad need to start from scratch and simplest setup. Move the 2nd PC closer to the 1st PC so we could use crossover cable to plug them both in *directly* (not via a "joiner") and see if the 2nd PC can ping the 1st.

I agree with those that suggested it's a cabling issue. I have no idea how the cable joiner works but if I was doing it I wouldn't use it as it introduced another variable that can go wrong.


last edited by Opec at 19:46:47 31/May/06

dammiit I knew someone was gonna throw the words USB and NETWORK in here somewhere!@%#$

Maybe the Ozcableguy will have some better info. 'Sorry I couldn't be any more help than that dude

my missus' dad has just turned 70, he set up his own wireless lan, he then decided to wire it entirely in cat6, hes completely set up a linux network and webserver, and while they are on holidays he has set up motion detect cameras that take photos and email us if someone breaks into his house.


so i can entirely see where nats is coming from with his dad wanting to do this himself and it being in his nature :p

so why's he posting here!??~!^%$#@

jim is old and tung chucks