OKay, IM sorry but this really s*** me.
The advertisments on TV i find really offensive.
Brain washing children with a catchy tune and having people dressed up in suits is just wrong.
Making childish make there desisions based on a TV ad they saw is wrong. If you belive in a realigion
Keep it to your self and stop forcing other people to join what you belive in. Im sick of people knocking
on my door preaching to me how bad i am because i dont belive in some fantasy that was created millions of years ago.
I find the ads to be unrelivent, If we wanted to join some church then im sure we would of gone out and done it a long time ago
There just taking it too far, Keep it to there selfs i say. Its just plain anyoying when you are strong feeling agents religion and you have to repetivily see this kinda crap on tv.

Discuss.

i have strong feelings against majority of ads on tv, build a bridge already.

what ads ne way

The ones where the people with the people in suits are singing " GOD LOVE YOU SOO MUCH, Not just a f***ing little but alot" and the others where there are people going, CHURCH is fun, well see you in our church wasting your time on sunday.

There selling faulse advertisting, You will not be happier if you start to belive in something you will never see or hear from. Let alone asking it for help, better off asking a brick wall for help, youll get the same answers

The Church is a business like any other, why shouldn't they advertise? Seems perfectly appropriate.

Whether you buy an ab-machine, hair removal wax, or join a church, you are being sucked into the same con that is television advertising.

why shouldnt religions be allowed to advertise? I dont have a problem against it...more information is better for everyone

a church is not a bussniess, they dont get money for having more people comming.
Advertisting the church would be ooook i guess, but the way they are brain washing people is just rediculous.
You dont see mcdonalds walking up to your front door saying, buy maccas its better than the rest.
there a much bigger bussniess

a church is not a bussniess, they dont get money for having more people comming.

Yes they do.

You dont see mcdonalds walking up to your front door saying, buy maccas its better than the rest.

no they dont, but i have other companies trying to sell me things at my front door, i have other businesses calling me at home, i have companies emailing me and puting stuff in my letterbox

also as for the brain-washing...let me get this straight, only religious advertising automatically converts people, it's the only form of influential advertising...is that what you're saying morgish

riiight

a church is not a bussniess, they dont get money for having more people comming.

No offense Morgs, but that is a pretty damn amusing statement.

ok, u might have noticed i have only been to church once.
But i guessing they only get money from more people because of donations?

You dont see mcdonalds walking up to your front door saying, buy maccas its better than the rest.

Man, I wish they did, then I wouldn't even need to get in the car to get it!

hahah trog, ok.. bad example :P

seriously morgish, you have some seriously wrong and stereotyped misconceptions about the church.

all religions should get f***ed

Its the same thing as an ad that tells you to go out and buy a large dildo. You can think to yourself, 'hey, I want a dildo now, ill go and buy that one on TV', or you can think, 'hey, I dont need a dildo, Ill ignore the add'.

When I get back from work Ill flame you and say that your retarded a couple of times.

You complete mong!

If you would just THINK about what you've said even a little you'd see that you're completely smacked up!

- I go to church and believe in God/Christ and I AM happier for it and believe that my life etc is better for it

- The churches "income" is based on the offerings of it's attendee's so in theory more ppl should mean more money but it all depends what the ppl going feel they should give

- You jump on this forum and tell us what is wrong according to you, so what makes you any different/better than this so called religious spam?!?

Believe in what you want, but don't flame that which is different to your beliefs, it makes you no better then the n00b that says CS is gay.

ahah your sig rox wolf

it makes you no better then the n00b that says CS is gay.

flame bait

http://sicklittlemonkeys.netfirms.com/images/halloweenpriest.jpg

hahaha

mrwolf summed it up pretty nicely there.

GumbyNoTalent: BAHAHAHAHAHH!!!!
Wolf: I didnt say that religious people them self are bad people. What i was saying and you miss understood was. If you belive in something like a religion you should keep it to your self and not hassel people to join your Belives. I think the ads on TV are very wrong in the way they try to proswade (spelling?) people into joining there chruch beacuse they promise that you will be a happier and better person. To be a better person wouldnt spending the time u sepnd at church on the homeless a much better thing for the community and the people them self, wich would in return make you a better person? They say 'God love you' How do they know that for a fact? Have they spoken to god? have they seen god? I dont think so. And until they prove that have the spoken to him/her and asked if he loves it. I rest my case.

ahhahahaha oooooooohhhh nooooooooooooOOOOOOooo

roofle...i may not have the best grammar either but: miss understood, proswade...teehee

as for your inane post...you have a problem with religion (well christianity it seems) because of its lack of hard and fast facts or some other better word i cant think of right now. You're not alone, it seems a lot of people on the net and people with that technology leaning have a lot of trouble coming to terms with religion and understanding it.

all i say to those type of people is maybe you shouldnt be so close minded and base your opinions on fact and experiences (check out the church) rather than ranting on the net proving you have no real knowlegde of what you're talking about.

Have I seen God?... Have you seen the wind? How do know wind is real?

ahh the RE teacher used that one in year 9 MrWolf, good stuff :D

I think the ads on TV are very wrong in the way they try to proswade (spelling?) people into joining there chruch beacuse they promise that you will be a happier and better person

well thats what they (and i) believe, how is that the wrong way? they want to share god with the general public. if you want to tell people that your P4 is faster than anything out there, you would also advertise on TV.

To be a better person wouldnt spending the time u sepnd at church on the homeless a much better thing for the community and the people them self, wich would in return make you a better person?

thats rather subjective, really the fact of the matter is your doing neither (afaik), either of those would 'make you a better person' in certin ways, however in this case they are 2 different angles completely.

They say 'God love you' How do they know that for a fact?

it is written may times in the scriptures.

i think im becoming desensitised to ads now i just switch off unless they are clever and it still isent gonna pursuade me to buy the product unless its really f***ing awesome deal on it.

As for churchs i say they should leave us/me the hell alone they should provide information on their believes on the internet or at their church and anyone wanting to change religions can do so themselves, im tired of people coming to my door and asking me to join their religion and they use little old ladies which makes ya feel sorry to close the door on em :S

Ohh great!!! If it is written down and atributted, then it must be true! GG

Religion is a moral belief system, be thankfull that 90% of the worlds population follow a moderate religion/code of ethics. I tell U now that if we didn't have benevolent religious systems none of use would be here writing on this forum. The human race would have not evolved because we would of been at war with one another!

Have I seen God?... Have you seen the wind? How do know wind is real?

U can see it in the trees and u can feel it.

Religeon is fuked ....all god squaderz are human waste feeble minded wankerz

Have I seen God?... Have you seen the wind? How do know wind is real?

God? who?

Religion is a f***in joke and it can kiss my ass!

that is all..

Reverend: hahahahah harsh.

roofle...i may not have the best grammar either but: miss understood, proswade...teehee

Add to that. This one in the first post...

unrelivent

proswade

I see

My Opinion: Religion SUCKS !

Have I seen God?... Have you seen the wind? How do know wind is real?

Oh dear .. get the f*** off my forum plzkthxbi.

Morgish, I respect your argument, but mate, whinging about it to a public group really makes you no better than them.
Its hard to hold back sometimes, but seriously, in my opinion you'll be better for it if you can at least respect other peoples right to beleive what the f*** they want, no matter how retarded it is.

Just think for yourself and try to form your opinions with as little peer influence as possible.

If you see an add that offends you, be it religous propaganda or just something else lame, fair enough whinge about it, laugh at it, whatever, but then just ignore it.

also, No fun at all - The Believers, lyrics

i dont believe in organised religion...it makes no sense at all.

Science without religion is lame...
Religion without science is blind...

Sure our world evolved, but its stupid to think space and time appeared out of nowhere.

Sure our world evolved, but its stupid to think space and time appeared out of nowhere.

It's even stupider to speculate and assume and believe so passionately to the point of causing wars and the deaths of millions in a completely unfounded idea of how it did appear.

I do practice my religion, but i've never ever told anyone to join it, i've hardly talked about it, only if non muslims ask me questions then i answer them, other wise, i mind my own business.

morgish, your english just dropped down 100 notches, out of a total 100.

i hate the christian ads (haven't seen one for a while, don't watch much tv), but i hate all ads. i hate advertising completely.

i agree, people should not try to convert other people. my father belongs to some church list (mormon or something?) but never went while i've been alive. they kept coming round and visiting, i really never wanted to see them.

as to verticalseafoodtaco saying this

proving you have no real knowlegde of what you're talking about

i must reply with the fact that religious people have no knowledge either, because knowledge is something you know. you don't know god exists, you believe it. knowledge is cold and and solid, belief is what is malleable.

knowledge, in its true form, may not even exist (as far as its definition is concerned).

i know organised religion is a mixture of too much hope, faith and imagination dan. But you would have to be a f***ing idiot to not believe space was created. Our race could be compared to a child wondering into a large library filled with books, the child knows someone had to have created these books but he doesnt know who or understand why they were created. Soon the child suspects that a mysterious order created all the books and uses his imagination to fill in the gaps.

I cannot imagine a God who rewards and punishes the objects of his creation, whose purposes are modelled after our own, a God, in short, who is but a reflection of human frailty.

People with no religion are weak in a way, because they can't follow rules and obey rules.

*not ment to offend anyone.

WRONG!
people who follow a religion are weak because they can not live with the fact that we dont know why we are here and how we got created.
They have to know that there is a god that made us because with out that knowlegde they would die.

i probably go to church/chapel more times a week than you people and i am not even christian

I can see that this is gonna turn into a flame war soon enough, and I'm not one to start spouting religion so I wont.

But I will leave it with one last comment...

If I'm wrong and I die and there is no heaven what has I missed out on? No sex b4 marriage, no drinking till I can't remember how I got home? Big deal. But if I'm right...

God/infinum questions that hurt to think about....what is outside of the universe if somthing what is outside of that...what was there before nothing?

suhaib is wrong, and morgish is wrong, and in some ways, you are both right.

People with no religion are weak in a way, because they can't follow rules and obey rules.

*not ment to offend anyone.

yeah, good job at not offending f***stick.

People with no relgion have thier own set of f***ing rules, its called common sense.

Our universe is on an axis revolving...there is one rule and differnt sized scales...

eg:

Time is revolving, earth is revolving, the solar system is revolving, our galixy is revoling thus our universe is revolving....everything is done to scale. A chain reaction which ended up creating life.

Astrology is the closest thing to a "religion" we humans have because the planets do effect us, we all know our closest planet the moon effects the movement of water (its a fact)

damn that's what i was going to say, but got sidetracked. :(

People with no religion are weak in a way, because they can't follow rules and obey rules.

ahah, dan already smacked that comment down, but its still pretty funny.

I'd rather follow the rules of the law and of common sense than follow rules that are rationalised by some book written several thousand years ago by people whose mere existense is debatable, built on logic of an unproven supreme being.

Religion started out as being how humans explained stuff they didn't understand. It turned into a system of control, because the people that ruled the religion, ruled the information - these are the people that made the decisions about their societies.

Which do you think is "weak"? People that can think for themselves, or people that have been instructed how to think inside a tiny little box called "religion"?

Which do you think is "weak"? People that can think for themselves, or people that have been instructed how to think inside a tiny little box called "religion"?

BAM THANK YOU!!

Christianity was imposed by force upon a reluctant world.
It has only been by use of deadly force on a large scale that the church has managed to maintain its dominion for so many centuries.

in many ways, the religious crusades of old were worse than hitler.

hehe good job trog :)

I refuse to take anything seriously thats taken from a book about talking snakes and people who can walk on water. grow up.

my life and faith teacher the other day said that some of the stories are like the ones that stoned story tellers tell.

and he is a priest adn he said that religions is the making of a bunch of stoned mofos.

but if you look over the history books and you go over them properly and closly you will see religion (to be more specific christianity) was made for the sole purpose of controling people.

unlike budhism and religions like that where it is about inerself, christianity is one of the only religions that have a controling god.

*end rant*

budda got his method of inner peace his way by studying nature, jesus got his inner peace by believing in a personal god. Each man has his own way...christianity just took it too far.

I believe in whatever I want
I choose not to believe in a god for one main reason
they say that something is so complex, like the human body, that it couldn't have occured through what we see as nature
but that would prove god's existences, and God's "existences" depends on us not knowing if he really exists or not.
every god falls under the same general contradictions....
I don't care what people believe, as long as they don't force their crap on me, and it doesn't hurt anyone physically or emotionally

anyway
yes

cobz, not to be picky, but time is not revolving, it is progressing. it doesn't form a loop. there was a beginning of time and there will be an end of time

trog, well done

morgish, people can usually ignore ads if they want to, or are u just too weak minded? :P j/k

i think that religion, while not neccessarily a private thing, is something that should not be forced or even "inflicted" upon others. jhahova's witnesses anyone? i don't believe in god, and i don't claim to follow every bit of scientific conjecture. i am secure enough in myself to admit that i don't know. i'm not going to live my life to a code laid down by a book written 2000 years ago with customs and rules that have no baring in current day society, or are just plain repugnant. if i'm wrong, and there is a god, then i'll guess i'll pay the price when i die, but i'd personally rather that you're born, you live, you die, and that's it. to quote that most excellent movie dogma (albiet quoting imperfectly)

For what? To pay homage to some god who threatens you with "be good, be good or i'll f***ing spank you"

I'm an atheist but believe that religion has it's purpose. It often helps people feel more secure in their lives and causes them to live in a relationship of "cause and effect" so that they don't have to face the infinite or unpredictable. Religion controls the populace and causes a certain sense of restraint to the individual. This is mainly caused by fear of consequences, "hell" being a primary example here. I am an atheist because I believe that science better explains our universe than any religion (to my knowledge) has managed to do. Belief in "God" or "a god" or even "multiple higher beings" can be a great benefit to some. However organised religion, especially catholicism and muslim religions (or extremist factions thereof), can cause extreme upheavel to the detrement of society. Just look at the witch burnings in Europe, the crusades or the current issues with terrorism. This is why I dislike organised religion. It is a remnant of the feudal system of the middle ages used to control the lowly workers and peasantry.

relegin is f***ing gay

i cant even spell it. foad relegin

s*** your right erik, i wasnt thinking in perspective when i wrote that, i think i was thinking about how humans created the day and night 12 till 12 thing but in general, time doesnt backtrack, just our perspective of it.

Religion topics are as boring as hell, because i dont CARE what people think about it. This disscussion is lame and repetitive.

Religion topics are as boring as hell

Boring as hell

Boring as hell

jesus christ, i think someone is trying to point out some god damned contradictions in your post spilmer!

I don't know how to quote on this forum but here's a few reponses...

- There is more literary proof that Jesus Christ is who it's written He is and did what is written He did than there is that Napolian existed.

- If science can say here's a monkey bone and here's a human bone, therefore we have evolution, why can't it provide and evidence of the bone structure in between said money and human?!? Surely there must be a phossil somewhere of an inbetween part of the evolution?

- How can you be an atheist and yet believe religion has a purpose? An athiest believes in no God(s) therefore religion to those God(s) is non-existant.

- There is more literary proof that Jesus Christ is who it's written He is and did what is written He did than there is that Napolian existed.

Im not denying a bloke named Jesus lived and died, but that doesnt mean i have to beleive the supposed stuff he did based on 2000 year old literature
Information written on napolean would certainly much more recent and advanced and therefor more plausable.
But then, its not asif people are structuring beleif systems of napolianism and door to dooring getting people to think the same, is it?

- If science can say here's a monkey bone and here's a human bone, therefore we have evolution, why can't it provide and evidence of the bone structure in between said money and human?!? Surely there must be a phossil somewhere of an inbetween part of the evolution?

There are f***loads of fossils of less than human humans, go read n stuff.

- How can you be an atheist and yet believe religion has a purpose? An athiest believes in no God(s) therefore religion to those God(s) is non-existant.

Because he's silly and contradicted.

oh yeah, dont think i want to get into a full on debate here, im just bored so thought id take a knock on a couple of dumb things u tried to point out.
I havent read/studied the bible and i never will.

You can beleive in whatever, so long as you dont expect me to :)

You can beleive in whatever, so long as you dont expect me to :)

yeah that's true

my personal view on jesus...

he was regarded as the 'osama bin laden' - populist leader of repressed poor poeoples, preaching the word of this fantastic 'god' character, and of morals and values on how to live by etc... of 2000 years ago by the bad romans 'americans' of the time.


he, like osama bin laden has/had a body doubles. when the romans came to kill him, the body double either replaced him at the spot, or became the new jesus after he was killed and alive the next day by 'AN ACT OF GOD'...

a perfect pretext to prove what he'd been preaching to masses

Have I seen God?... Have you seen the wind? How do know wind is real?

U can see it in the trees and u can feel it.

Well, thats the point.... You answered correctly there morgish. Seriously, just let the people that follow a religion be, maybe even read a bible or something. Read it objectively and with an open mind. Im not religous, the only faith I have is in myself, but the bible is an interesting read if youre bored.

Have I seen God?... Have you seen the wind? How do know wind is real?

Man, check what's in the weed ur smokin and then pass it around

Quote:

"my personal view on jesus...

he was regarded as the 'osama bin laden' - populist leader of repressed poor poeoples, preaching the word of this fantastic 'god' character, and of morals and values on how to live by etc... of 2000 years ago by the bad romans 'americans' of the time.


he, like osama bin laden has/had a body doubles. when the romans came to kill him, the body double either replaced him at the spot, or became the new jesus after he was killed and alive the next day by 'AN ACT OF GOD'...

a perfect pretext to prove what he'd been preaching to masses"

This is not a very good comparison. You see, Osama Bin Laden was a terrorist. He manipulates religion to coerce people into committing acts that are clearly against the original religion.

Jesus however, was not a pacifist, but was non-violent in his protests. And his protests were against the religion of the time. Specifically Judaism, which was HIS religion. He did not intimidate anybody, He did not murder anybody.

Now picture this in the timeframe it was set in. The Romans had conquered Israel and were oppressing them very harshly. The Jews read their scriptures and were hoping for a Messiah king to come and free them from Roman oppression. Several cults formed around the time, all based on violence and a "fight" against the Romans. There were the Zealots, and the group (can't remember their name off the top of my head) who wrote the dead sea scrolls. In fact, at least one of Jesus' followers was a former Zealot.

If you read the four reliable accounts of Jesus' life (those accounts that were written within one generation of his existance), a clear pattern emerges. On one hand were Jesus' followers, who believed that he was the Messiah King who would ride into Jerusalem and free the Jews from Roman oppression. On the other hand was Jesus who was saying things like "pay your taxes", "be a good citizen", "rejoice in your oppression" and many other things along those lines. NOBODY GOT IT.

Then the biggest blow of all. Jesus was murdered. In the most brutal way possible, by the most brutal people the world has known. It is accepted that crucifiction is one of the most painful and humiliating ways to die. You see, there are certain nerves that run right through where the nails puncture your arms. You slowly suffocate over a long period of time. The word "excruciating" is derived from "crucifiction". Make no mistake, it was not a form of punishment that anybody wished upon another. It was cruel, painful and humiliating, and the Romans were professionals. They killed many many Jews in that manner.

The Romans had no reason to murder Jesus. They could not care. They were indifferent. Their concerns were with the more militant groups of the time. However, due to pressure by the Jewish leaders, the Romans eventually were persuaded to arrest and murder Jesus. The same man who had stood up and preached in front of everyone at the temple for the last few days was being executed on the cross. Make no mistake, everybody knew who was being killed. Jesus disciples all fled, denying that they ever knew him. They were afraid.

Then three days later, reports start surfacing that Jesus was not dead, but alive. Reports started by women, whos opinions didn't even count in a court of law. Not too long after, the former followers of Jesus begin to spread the word that He was alive again. Every single one of them, other that Jesus' betrayer, was prepared to lose their lives for their belief that Jesus had come back to life. And all but one of them DID get martyred for the message.

All the Jews or Romans had to do was produce a body and the story would have been shot to pieces. There was no physical way that anybody could have survived a crucifiction, especially after their side had been pierced and the blood had already seperated (a medical discovery made hundreds of years after John's description).

There was no way that anybody could have mistaken who was killed, and it is even less likely that ten out of eleven of Jesus' closest friends would DIE for a lie. "Once you have eliminated all of the possible options, what is left, however unlikely is the truth". That quote is a famous Sherlock Holmes quotation. It is what logic is based upon.

Some will question the historical accuracy of the gospels. However, people do not argue that Julius Caesar performed all that was accredited to him, and yet all the sources we have for that date very, very late. However, there has been copies of the gospels found that date no later than AD 70. To deny that they are historically accurate is to deny the whole of history. It would be like somebody writing a book on Hitler today. There are people who are still alive today who can confirm or deny the accuracy of it.

So yes, I believe in Christ. I do not believe that all Christians are perfect, and I do accept that there are some genuinely evil people who claim to be Christians. I do accept that there will be people who try to manipulate Christianity for their own gain (eg the crusades). That does not mean that Christianity is wrong. To base your lack of belief on individuals that do not practice what they claim to believe is both foolish and illogical.

Research before you speak.

-Smegged

sif you woudlnt just get over what gets played on tv and just accept.

trying to change things and bitching about them just requires effort, effort that could be used on these forums ( bitching about bitching ) anyway im confused and im not wearing pants so i best leave it at that.

can i have my fridge back sir.

praise the lard

smegged, who says its not a good comparison.
how do u know jesus wasnt viewed as a terrorist of 2000 years ago?

you dont, u believe a finctional book that contradicts itself in many ways, and blindly accept something for which there is no real proof..

im not saying there was no jesus or is no god, its just strange that there were all these so called miracles for jesus, but where were the miracles for the other prophets?

and if u read between the lines, the romans did have a reason to kill him, much the same reason why america has a reason to kill osama.

I don't see why I would be an idiot to think the universe wasn't created or whatever. I base my beliefs on facts and rules I see in my everyday life. If I was to make judgements on how the universe was created it would be based on these, which is silly (maybe) because I wouldn't have a clue how the universe was created, if it WAS created. It doesn't matter what anyone says, no one actually has a freaking clue about the universe. How long it has existed, how big it is. It's all just speculation on the behald of scientists, and religious people, who also don't really have a clue, there just saying it for peace of mind.

Cainer, how do you know that the four gospels (the only books I've even mentioned) are fictional? You don't. In fact they are more historically accurate than most of the sources of information for leaders such as Alexander the Great. According to the method historians use to determine historical accuracy.

Yes, Jesus was a terrorist. He terrorised the religious leadership of the time with questions that they could not answer. Don't get me wrong, Jesus was a hated man. But the Romans had bigger fish to fry. In secular Roman history, Pontious Pilate (the guy who killed Jesus) was considered weak, and did a lot of things to make himself popular with the ruling classes of the time. Herrod did not care about Jesus, and so did not bother convicting him of anything. The only reason Pilate did was to gain popularity with the Jewish religious leadership.

Make no mistake, whereas Bin Laden's campain is all about terror, Jesus' campain was all about acceptance. Please, if you are going to argue about certain things (the gospels' accuracy) then at least read the books first.

this thread is bringing the best out of all of us.

I just Had to join in, and just pull out a few quotes that I thought were amusing.

In fact they are more historically accurate than most of the sources of information for leaders such as Alexander the Great.

There is more literary proof that Jesus Christ is who it's written He is and did what is written He did than there is that Napolian existed.

These two are my favourites. Just a question did you pull these facts out of thin air? and if not where's the information to inform us all.

Wait, Wait I have one as well, George Washington didn't really exist. He didn't. Really.

If I'm wrong and I die and there is no heaven what has I missed out on? No sex b4 marriage, no drinking till I can't remember how I got home? Big deal. But if I'm right...

I was under the impression that if you didn't truely belive in "God" then you wouldn't ascend to Heaven anyway. So what's the point in only semi-believing about of being frightened?


I don't believe.

the problem is, most of you don't know the first thing about these religions but you pretend to know all about their weaknesses.

eg. you talk about being "better people"...well Christianity at least is NOT about being kind and generous and praying 5 times a day (thats Islam). It's about EVERYONE doing the wrong thing (who here can say they've never done anything hurtful to someone?) and EVERYONE needing forgivness. Therefore Christians believe that EVERYONE should know about what they believe.

anyway my point is that most of you seem to think that all religions are about doing more things right than wrong in life so that you might go to heaven if ur good enough.

I have no problem with churches advertising, though i've never seen these ads...

i honestly dont care what someone belives in, if a book about some guy called jesus helps someone get through there day to day life then so be it, or if some fat guy that sits under a tree helps someone then so be it, thats where people are forgetting what religion is all about, its about helping you and guideing you through your day to day life, stoping you from doing stupid s*** like killing yourself or killing others or what not, its when idiots get carried away and start trying to push the way that helps them most onto someone that has a way that already helps them that things start to f*** up.

as most things do in this age religion has become very commercialized, and has become a good way to make some lil man very rich, there isnt anything you can do about it but ignore it, the more people that ignore it the most likly it will go away ( HAVNT YOU SEEN THAT f***ING SIMPSONS EP WHERE ALL THE ADVERTISING BECOMES ALIVE )

and also, the bible was written by man, not by god. and so far man has been a complete dick to everyone, so sif youd trust him.

The best Christians are those who pick and chose certain aspects of its teachings to live by. For example not believing the "creation" in the Old Testament is real, whereas certain events within the New Testamant has more basis in fact. There are a whole slew of reasons why this is somewhat pathetic but then again that is the nature of religious beliefs sometimes (note the sometimes).

I know of a few people like this and it is like it is because they wish to avoid certain avenues of criticism from their peers and also perhaps to present themselves as more intelligent, logical or 'enlightened' then other fellow Christians, whether they are aware of this or not.

It's really appropriate because it's so reminiscient of the society we live in today. Pick and choose, consumerism as religion, as belief. Personally I don't dislike these kind of people, but it is amusing to see how they justify such a system of belief. I wonder if they really do believe...

Just thought I'd share.


Oh and this one was amusing

- How can you be an atheist and yet believe religion has a purpose? An athiest believes in no God(s) therefore religion to those God(s) is non-existant.

Because he's silly and contradicted.

To the first person, you missed Hashy's point completely, and to the second person, you also have no clue (unless you were being sarcastic but i doubt it). Don't put people down based upon something you have no knowledge about.

I havent read/studied the bible and i never will

Then please admit you will never know more than 50% of the story which makes your arguments somewhat biased and ignorant.


XandraX, Greyden, Hashy just to name a few, are on the right track. Most of you hardly know anything substantial about Christianity yet you talk it down. And to Mr Wolf, your argument are used by Christians everywhere, it's like a broken record, and the whole attitude of "at least I'm safe if what I believe in turns out to be true when I die" is somewhat pathetic don't you think? If this is really why you are Christian, or an important aspect of it, then you must be content with the fantastic way you live. Intimidated, fearful, I would say you're even betraying some of what is meant to be important Christian 'ideals'. (If you meant it in jest then ignore the last paragraph)

I have no problems with religion and the arguments/opinions for/against it... when they are justified... it's just that it is a goddamn shame some people don't have a clue when they attempt to present their point/s :)

The biggest hypocrisy in the world today would have to be the “Christian” based religions, most stemming from the Catholic Church. Indeed over the centuries the Catholic Church has been responsible directly for the deaths of millions through conquest and colonization of the world.

A few facts you may not have known, if you are Anglo Saxon descendant, you are the lucky ones that had your heathen ways curtailed by the Romans (ironic as these were the guys that crucified Christ), yet most of our pagan traditions were adopted by the Roman Catholic church to make it easier to convert us.

Easter – Funny how Christ just happened to be crucified on the spring solacer, a major pagan festival of fertility, where the giving of brightly died eggs was a symbolic gesture, thou this wasn’t directly adopted by the church the date was.

Christmas – Also falls on the winter solacer, which was also a major pagan festival, this one occurred in the middle of winter, so after weeks of living on top of one another in your longhouse, you would alleviate the boredom by making gifts for others. Then in true pagan spirit you would get drunk, eat and fornicate while showering those you loved with gifts.

An for the Christians, why is it that the flock (you guys), must be charitable and giving to those less fortunate while the Catholic Church remains one of the richest organizations in the world. Mother Theresa raised millions for her cause of which only a small percentage found it’s way to those that it was intended, the rest ended in the coffers of the Vatican.

Organised religion, especially in Western Society has a lot to answer for, hypocritically claiming Christian morals, they are a farce that should practice what they preach. Evangelic religions like those in America are the worst of the lot.

And finally, only those weak of mind and spirit would look for a higher meaning to life outside the realms of physics and science. If you can’t handle the fact that you are biological and will cease to exist forever when you die, then go to church. For those who believe we have a sole and animals don’t, then please explain why higher order animals like monkeys and dolphins are self aware, the main criteria for distinguishing man from the animals? At least these higher order animals don’t destroy their habitat, nor do they consume more than is necessary of their natural resources.

probably allready mentioned (i cbf reading through 5 pages)

have you see the ad in the middle of the night for the band called "DCdawg" or something

its hilarious!

hahahahah

Then please admit you will never know more than 50% of the story which makes your arguments somewhat biased and ignorant.

I will admit that Ill never know more than 50% of the story, of course my argument is biased, I have no need to be objective, ive seen and read enough to form my own opinion in a manner that is far from ignorant so leave me the f*** alone.
Why should every atheist be expected to read every peice of religous literature in existance back to front just so we can present a holeproof argument and justify our lack of belief? get a f***ing clue.

asifreligionduzznrawxj00!!!

or not ... does it really matter? I am pretty sure I will never find out from this forum !! HAH!

Also, The flux bends ! , gyrations & sub-causical fluctuations hint towards the presence of Tran.

atheist doesnt mean your antigod or anti religion, it just means you dont belive in any of the religions or gods that are out there

seeing as what i belive in isnt actually a religion im forced under the catogory of atheist. which i dont really mind, seeing as im growing up with a youth that honestly doesnt give a f***.

a·the·ist
One who disbelieves or denies the existence of God or gods.

ag·nos·tic
One who believes that it is impossible to know whether there is a God.
One who is skeptical about the existence of God but does not profess true atheism.
One who is doubtful or noncommittal about something.

Agnostic for me thx. :]

Better an open mind, than an open mouth

(note that the don't have a clue was in reference to your response to Hashy's post. From now on the word 'you' is used instead of 'one' because it sounds better)

In any case,
It's not about just justifying your lack of belief or reading text. Also, ignorance and bias involves magnitude, they aren't just switches. It's more about justifying the points you make (and that doesn't 'have' to come through quoting text or acadaemic research but it sometimes does) and accepting new/different information/opinions then modifying your current stance if appropriate. If you have an opinion (you are definately entitled to one), then back it up with rubbish (term used loosely), and blatantly ignore everyone else's opinion, then your stance is worthless and/or greatly lessened.

A certain amount of objectivity is beneficial in most arguments/debates/issues. If there is no objectivity then it is basically pointless. Two people shouting at a brick wall...

Not everything was/is directed at Dan, this goes for me, everyone, but that was the point I'm trying to make.

Better an open mind, than an open mouth

A truly open mind, a truly uncertain stance

Though I do agree...

I got a copule of geriatics that came a knocking, and they started to preach to me, so I told them I was a christian in the hope that they would leave, but this was a MISTAKE!!! The preaching just got more technical as they thought I was more qualified to understand it. Upon leaving they announced to me "oh, we'll be back in 2 or 3 weeks to sit down with you and you bible and go through sections of it with you." Hmmm, that's one doorbell I won't be answering!

- How can you be an atheist and yet believe religion has a purpose? An athiest believes in no God(s) therefore religion to those God(s) is non-existant.

Because he's silly and contradicted.

Thanks for backing me up here Scene, you both seem to have missed my point entirely. I am an athiest, which would mean I disbelieve in the existance of god; yet I believe religion has a purpose, and that is to instigate laws and to allow people explanations for the yet unexplained. Here's my post again, please re-read.

I'm an atheist but believe that religion has it's purpose. It often helps people feel more secure in their lives and causes them to live in a relationship of "cause and effect" so that they don't have to face the infinite or unpredictable. Religion controls the populace and causes a certain sense of restraint to the individual. This is mainly caused by fear of consequences, "hell" being a primary example here. I am an atheist because I believe that science better explains our universe than any religion (to my knowledge) has managed to do. Belief in "God" or "a god" or even "multiple higher beings" can be a great benefit to some. However organised religion, especially catholicism and muslim religions (or extremist factions thereof), can cause extreme upheavel to the detrement of society. Just look at the witch burnings in Europe, the crusades or the current issues with terrorism. This is why I dislike organised religion. It is a remnant of the feudal system of the middle ages used to control the lowly workers and peasantry.

yet I believe religion has a purpose, and that is to instigate laws and to allow people explanations for the yet unexplained

This is allready established, there is no need for established religion and supernatural beliefs, my god is better than your god, this is what causes the wars.

We as modern civilised nations have a set of laws, many of these laws already allow things that are against many religions. Laws are more and more becomming based on common sense and decency rather than religous teachings and church and state becomming more and more seperated.

There is NO need for religion in modern society, none at all.

what channel do you watch? I don't see any religious ads on TV

Dan, what you say has a definate point, but the sad fact of the matter is that some societies simply could not continue to function without religious boundries in place - but you're correct, for the majority of the western world, religion is somewhat out of place and I'm sure we could function without it.

haha funny religious debate, who the f*** cares....

HAIL LORD SATAN






Long live atheism

Haha, indeed.

My thoughts on how silly religions are aside, (to get back on topic for a moment) kids are impressionable and the last thing i want to see is them getting indoctrinated by anyone into believing anything.

I know i can't beat the zealots in these kind of arguments (they still hang around at cavill at schoolies? How many of you wasted your time arguing with them?) and it's pointless trying because they are lost to it (and some are quite good arguers) but their preying on the weak children is pretty sick.

I think i look at religion as some kind of sickness, i won't think any worse of you as a person but i still feel that there is just something wrong with you.

but in general, time doesnt backtrack

oh ho, that depends.

there is relative "time", which is what we experience as time influenced by forces such as gravity. there is the total idea of time, which is the 4th dimension, which includes "relative time" and all time in the universe.

then there is absolute time (not sure if that's the "scientific" term for it) - even if time were to go backwards as the universe crunched back in (for whatever reason), you could still say time was going on, by using an idea that is above our universe. like, every second that went backwards you could add to the total time of the life of the universe. follow me?

so time could backtrack, as far as relative time is concerned, depending on what the universe does as a whole.

and time may be a loop, erik-the-red. it might be like a sine wave. or it might be completely linear, and infinite or not infinite. we just don't know :)

Wow ppl are really getting serious about this thread!

FEEL THE HEAT!

i just watched dogma.. lol

Everything in space follow certain rules and only differ in scale so it might be safe to say that just like universe to galaxy to solar system to planet there is more to add in the other direction and if it ever ends the last shell would hold that time.

Time slows down when travelling at insane speeds so i guess if you built yourself something that fast you could travel for 5 years away from the earth and then 5 years back going at the same insane speed and the earth would be 30 years older the time you got back, you can travel into the future (not instantly) but you cant go back unless our universe was moving really f***ing fast leaving a trail of dimensions behind us only ever creating new paths if someone from another dimension came in and changed something, f***...who knows, bed sounds good right about now

that brings up time travel, which i don't believe is possible, for several theoretical reasons which i can't even remember any more.

maybe it's just 'cause i used to fantasise about time travel, and then i came to realise reality properly, and got sour about it.

... i didn't even mean to type that. i think i need sleep too.

One cant go back in time anyhow.

This uiniverse is only in beta and God didn't write exception handling.

here's my opinion:

i choose not to believe in god but at the same time respect the right for others to believe. however there are a few questions/views i put to you guys.

'a creation can never understand its creator' so how can we possibly hope to prove gods existence using our rule system of science? ans: we can't.

(taking some info from the bible here so correct me if im wrong) in the beginning god created heaven and earth ect. and he also created adam(male) and eve(female) from clay/mud. so at this point there are 2 not one, TWO humans in existence. adam and eve had 2 kids kane(male) and able(male). so now we have 3 MALES 1 FEMALE. kane killed able and left adam and eve. so now there are 2 MALES and 1 FEMALE in existence. kane comes back to adam and eve and he has a wife. WTF ? where did this second phantom woman come from? the only ans his mum eve or .... u fill in the blanks.

then on the flipside we have evolution. through chance the right mollecules at the right time fused big bang theories ect. however dont u think this is a little bit convenient ?

ill close with saying that i dont believe in god but im not sure i believe in evolution either.

currently ive just finished my 2nd year doing my science degree majoring in 'biochemistry and mollecular biology' and even with an educated perspective on evolution i still at the moment think its a little too convenient.

instead of branding people 'god boy' or 'heathen' ect why dont we just accept the fact they choose a different path and let em be.

sharkuul, u'll find that christians say that genesis wasn't a literal recording of events, just symbolic. still, i don't believe in god, but i love revelations/apocalypse/gothic stuff (no, not gothic as in those idiots with pale skin and black hair)

u'll find that christians say that genesis wasn't a literal recording of events

actually a significant proportian take it at it's word. Creation science puts forward good and solid scientific evidence, arguements and methodoligys to keep believers in evolution on thier toes. It makes for a rip roaring flame war at any time.

http://www.creationscience.com

What is the key evidence of evolution?

Billions of dead things buried in rock layers laid down by water all over the Earth

What is the key evidence of a biblical flood?

Billions of dead things buried in rock layers laid down by water all over the Earth

:)

hey that site's interesting.

thanks for the link codebasher!